/v/ - Video Games

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I never thought I'd see the day where people would actually -want- to return to the awful blur of CRTs.

>>270048
People will romanticize anything a decade after it stops being necessary.

>>270048
>>270050
it's got that something

>>270048
>blur
You're referring to the composite video signal and its inherent noisiness, 31khz VGA CRT monitors from the 1990s had no "blurring" whatsoever.

t. grew up playing virus ridden freeware and Bing Bing Wahoo via ZSNES on Windows 98

>>270046 (OP) 
why not just fake it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jh2ssirC1oQ

>>270048
You sure do love posting that shit, do you?

>>270046 (OP) 
Just liek, use a filter

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>>270048
>>270050
Pic very much related

>>270068
People often confuse extremity and novelty for perfection.
It's not even about the medium. Some people just want screaming.

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>>270068
Except that isn't at all related to this topic. It isn't about the limitations of old systems, but about the benefits actual hardware provided when (ab)used certain ways, which developers used to push past the limitations of the systems at the time. And those tricks are completely disregarded by modern hardware.

For instance OP's pic, the waterfall becomes semitransparent water on actual hardware, and looks like ugly vertical lines on modern displays. The grass looked fuzzy.
Pics related are other, more extreme examples. Pic 1 straight up uses NTSC artifacting to get colors out of monochrome hardware. Pic 2 uses the color averaging from composite to create colors not on the hardware palette. Pic 3 is what a CGA Palette 0 image looks like on modern hardware, versus pic 4 how it looks over composite. Getting 16 colors out of a 4 color palette. Fuck you if you want to pretend pic 3 looks better.

You can whine about blur all you want, but reality is things were designed for the hardware they had.

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>>270046 (OP) 
>You play 4th gen games on a CRT, right, anon?
>You don't play them on a 1440p LCD display like a chump, do you?
I wish i still had a CTR

>>270048
>>270050
Instead on being a "muh nostalgia glasses" retard, just take a look at this, this guy explains the reason old games looked better on CRTs better than i could.

https://inv.nadeko.net/watch?v=2sxKJeYSBmI

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>>270097
>this guy explains
But can you?  Summarize the argument for those of us without an hour to listen to special pleading by a biased nostalgiafaggot.  If you found the argument so convincing this shouldn't be hard for you.

Your GIF certainly isn't convincing.  One depicts crisp clear pixels and the other applies a shitty filter to it that just makes it darker and less coherent.

>>270090
>but reality is things were designed for the hardware
The problem is you have to cherry pick to make this assertion.  For every clear example of trying to abuse CRT deficiencies to produce an emergent graphical illusion, I can think of just as many skilled artists who couldn't be arsed to exploit CRT deficiencies because they knew full well that the quality of CRTs was enormously variable for consumers.  Trying to project the best CRT in the world onto how all old games were meant to be viewed is just a case of special pleading.

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>>270097
People conflate CRT TVs with CRT monitors and they're different in many ways. I miss my CRT monitor with its built in VGA cable. I should have never sold it when I moved. I still own my CRT TVs and they're good for some things like my old games, but they do have noticeable blur and bleed. A CRT monitor will look nice on most older games but typically have limitations like mine maxed out at 1600x1200 resolution but did 120hz if i lowered the resolution. It was 19" which comes to around 17" and change.

>>270114
Black levels look comparable to a modern OLED. Motion blur; even at 60fps/60hz they look clearer in motion than modern displays running at 360hz 360fps.
It's hard to showcase because you're looking at them on a modern monitor. This video is an ok example but it's really something to be seen in person.

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>>270097
That gif is a terrible example, since it's just a shitty filter.
Here are some better ones:

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sum moar

>>270122
Amazing that crt can change 10x8 pixel ass into something attractive.

>>270115
>hard to showcase because you're looking at them on a modern monitor
This is something that has always been funny to me about ads for new televisions. That wondeful picture they're showing you in that ad is being displayed by your apparently shit current screen. It's impossible to use your screen to show a screen be better than your screen.

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>>270114
>"nostalgiafaggot"
Not an argument, try again, retard.
<"please explain in a few words because i have the attention span of a goldfish"
The pixel art in old games wasn't supposed to look "crips" you weren't supposed to see the contrast between each individual pixel, but those pixels were supposed to blend together to have a softer, more armonious look, and not look like a bunch of little squares clashing together.
>imagine thinking that "crisp" pixel vomit on a big HD screen looks any good.
>>270122
>>270123
These are perfect examples, the character portraits in particular.
Those were supposed to look like hand drawn art, which they do on a CRT, not a "crisp" pixel mess like they do on a HD screen.

>>270114
>crisp clear pixels 

Sounds like you've only played modern "retro" games that were designed for screens where pixels are "crisp and clear". Not all games were designed for screens like that. Just take a look at what happens to the candle flames. The "crisp and clear" version looks like an upside down 't', nothing like a flame at all.

If people wanted "crisp and clear" pixels, why the fuck is anti-aliasing such a standard practice to get rid of any pixelated look for things that are meant to look natural?

>>270114
>Your GIF certainly isn't convincing.  One depicts crisp clear pixels and the other applies a shitty filter to it that just makes it darker and less coherent.
Less coherent?
You are just being disingenuous here, that filter is blurring the pixels together and softening the jagged outlines to make the picture MORE coherent, not less.
>>270123
Also look at how on LCD Peach's sprites lose that "fake 3D" effect that "Super Mario RPG" was going for.
To claim that shit on LCD looks any better is foolish.
>>270128
>Sounds like you've only played modern "retro" games that were designed for screens where pixels are "crisp and clear".
That's most likely his case, that's why he's arguing about how in his dumb opinion individual pixels must look "crisp and clear" in order to make the game look good.

>>270097
Don't fucking link me your jewtube eceleb slop, you platinum sausage guzzler. You guys whine about graphics cards constantly but when Scalper Joe tells you that you're not getting the Definitive Retro Experience™, that's when you listen?

Speaking of things that can't be shown on meme screens, are the supposed motion clarity improvements of the sub-frame beam scanning >filter introduced by Retroarch a few months back actually real?

t. doesn't have a 120hz monitor

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>>270130
>some random jewtube video by a fucking nobody
>e-celeb slop
Also, it's fucking invidious, it's not like you are giving that jewtuber views or anything.
I am not going to spend time to explain to a dense retard like you why older games looked better on a CRT, especially when you refuse to offer any compelling argument and go instead for the braindead:
<"mug nostalgia glasses!"
<"old=bad, new=nice"
Like a redditor.
Take a look a the screens posted here:
>>270122
>>270123
 and tell me that the pixellated crap on LCD looks better than the smooth picture on CRT.
Also this anon:
>>270126
>The pixel art in old games wasn't supposed to look "crips" you weren't supposed to see the contrast between each individual pixel, but those pixels were supposed to blend together to have a softer, more armonious look, and not look like a bunch of little squares clashing together.
>imagine thinking that "crisp" pixel vomit on a big HD screen looks any good.
Gave you a good answer, but since you are a disingenuous cocksucker, you ignored it and just kept going with you faggotry.

>>270122
>>270123
LCD looks better.  Sorry fam, I like actually seeing what the developers drew instead of a blurry mess.

>>270126
>Those were supposed to look like hand drawn art, which they do on a CRT
That's your dumb opinion, I certainly don't agree.

>>270128
>if you disagree... you've only played modern games!
Not only have I been playing games on shitty CRTs since the NES, but I've turned off anti-aliasing in my PC games since it was introduced in the late '90s.  Since the very beginning my personal taste has been that it wastes my GPU's resources while obscuring potentially useful 3D model information.

>>270129
>Also look at how on LCD Peach's sprites lose that "fake 3D" effect that "Super Mario RPG" was going for.
Says you.  It certainly doesn't for me.  And it's not a "fake 3D" effect, SMRPG's sprites were all pre-rendered 3D models captured at various angles.

CRTfags desperately want you to agree with them but they seem incapable of comprehending that their preference at the end of the day is entirely subjective.

>>270142
you're a nigger. They look completely different compared to those stills you see especially in motion.
I doubt you were even born in the 90's shaddap and drink your milk to grow up lil' tommy. You faget.

>underage hipsters pretending to be oldfags

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>>270146
>I doubt you were even born in the 90's
It would have required some special circumstances to have simultaneously grown up playing NES games if I was born in the '90s.

I'm loving the autism here.

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>>270142
>LCD looks better. 
Lmao
>>270142
>That's your dumb opinion, I certainly don't agree.
That's why you are being called a dense retard.
It's not an opinion, that's how the devs expected and wanted to game to look like.
You sound like a zoomer hipster faggot who wasn't even around when those games came out but pretends to know how they were supposed to look like.
You definitely never saw a good CRT in person and are just vomiting your clueless retarded opinion without knowing what are even talking about.
>Not only have I been playing games on shitty CRTs since the NES, but...
Suuure you did.
Lol

>>270142
>I like actually seeing what the developers drew instead of a blurry mess.

Valid personal preference. 

I too recall enjoying how unfiltered emulated games look even back then. It was cool to see the raw pixels vs what I was used to. I understand the appeal of both. 
But also keep in mind everything being shown is likely just a filter to approximate how CRTs look. Even if they were to photograph an actual CRT you’re still looking at it on your modern monitor.

For me the main appeal of CRTs is motion clarity, which blurbusters estimates you’d need around 1000hz to approach matching the motion clarity of a CRT.

>>270151
>that's how the devs expected and wanted to game to look like.
Which ones?  All of them?  Just the devs for visual contrast examples you're pointing to?  And your argument is... that they wanted it to look X way because you think it looks better than Y way, and anyone who doesn't prefer the X way is...

Surely you don't think this argument is going to convince anyone who doesn't already align with your preferences, anon.  That is of course why you have to lower yourself to lazy personal attacks.

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>>270153
>And your argument is... that they wanted it to look X way because you think it looks better than Y way, and anyone who doesn't prefer the X way is...
That is just shit you are making up, you buffoon.
If you don't understand a simple argument it's just your fault and nobody else's.

>>270142
>LCD looks better.  Sorry fam, I like actually seeing what the developers drew instead of a blurry mess.
Famalamino-fama, the developers made the games while looking at blurry CRTs,  therefore they only ever saw how it looks like on blurry CRTs. Preferring LCDs for these games is like saying you prefer to turn off textures and look at the resulting mess because that is what the modelers really modeled.

>>270153
The devs actually did test the games on CRTs to gauge how sprites snd effects would look while designing them. There are specific techniques for certain effects like transparency that they used specifically to work on CRTs. Devs absolutely intended the models to be seen on a CRT. This is pretty well known and talked about. 
It’s fine to like the blocky look of the raw data, but the devs fully intended the models to be seen on a CRT.

>>270140
<"b-b-but he's not very popular"
I don't care. You didn't even bother to webm it.
>bringing up reddit
Bitch, that site would want you to fall for this nonsense.
We used to make fun of Smashfags for carrying around those giant plastic bricks. Now it's current year and you're lecturing people who don't want to pay 150 dollars for dusty, decaying, half decade old hardware. Retro games and retro hardware have become big business because eceleb cunts have turned retro gaming from an interest into a lifestyle.
You can cherrypick all the use cases that you want. But until you show me a game that is objectively unplayable - neither emulated or on real hardware - without the use of a CRT, then I can only conclude that you're trying to make people feel bad for not wasting their money.

>>270149
Says you fat boi.

>>270149
>>270162
Snes launched in 1991. If you were born in 1990, you could be playing on an old NES by age 5 or whatever. First console I played was an intellevision and I was born in the late 80s. 
The 2nd console I ever played was a sega genesis and missed everything in between.

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>>270161
>I don't care. You didn't even bother to webm it.
<It's your fault my argument is bad because i am a lazy fuck and you won't spoon feed me
That's why people are calling you a retard, because that's exactly what you are.
Every single time you post you are proving it again and again.
>But until you show me a game that is objectively unplayable - neither emulated or on real hardware - without the use of a CRT, then I can only conclude that you're trying to make people feel bad for not wasting their money.
Way to move the goalpost,  you massive retard.
Here we were talking about old games looking much better on a CRT,  nobody was arguing that older games are "objectively unplayable" on newer monitors and you know it, but since you are becoming the thread's lolcow, you are now moving the goalpost to save face.
Can you play old pixel games on a shiny 4K 80" display?
Sure you can.
Would that old pixel game look better on that meme 4K 80' display compared to a CRT it was designed for?
Definitely not.
Besides, nobody here ever told you to buy a CRT from scalpers or to buy one at all, so what the fuck are you even bitching about, you queer?

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>>270161
><"b-b-but he's not very popular"
You are the faggot who refused to watch a video on invidious calling it "e-celeb slop".
Being an "e-celeb" implies being somewhat popular, if that guy who uploaded the video is just some random guy and not popular at all then you can't call him an "e-celeb".
Not that hard to understand, and that is why you are gay and your shit is all retarded.

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>>270168
>articulating an argument instead of relying on someone else to divine which aspects of an hour-long video you want to support your own argument is "spoon feeding"
You're a lazy fuck with no convictions who just wants other people to argue in your stead, most likely out of insecurity over being unable to defend your own slippery position.

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If this thread is such a mess anyway, then we might as well devolve it even further beyond.

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>>270046 (OP) 
I play them on a 1080p tcl tv with a retrotink

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>>270170
>He's still going at it
You are not doing yourself any favor.
People already explained to you why pixel games look better on CRT,  they even show you comparison pictures and you are still here with your autistic screeching because you are asking for explanations that Anons already gave you.

>>270174
Their arguments were poor and loaded with assumptions about viewer preference and artist intent, and consistently leaning into an unjustified conclusion that if one artist intended to utilize CRT hacks then all artists must have done the same.

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This recent faggotry feels far too coincidental to be a coincidence, it's one thing for retarded blacked.gov-tier GCfag/LCPnigger-esque shitflinging to pop up in the designated shitting thread or one (1) other thread, but for it to happen in multiple threads simultaneously given the board's low population smells of 40 year old Mexican Fatal Fury veterans employing the latest innovative tourney strats.
Also none of (You) have answered my question regarding the RA beam racing/scanning/raping shader and its effect on perceived motion clarity.

>>270161
<You didn't even bother to webm it.
It's an hour long you nigger, you want a 6x9 pixel webm for a video that relies heavily on visual information? 
Plus it's an invidious link, you wouldn't be giving him views either way.

>>270176
>spoiler
If I had a 120hz monitor, I'd gladly answer it for you. But alas.

>>270179
>It's an hour long you nigger, you want a 6x9 pixel webm for a video that relies heavily on visual information? 
You are wasting time anon, that faggot is way too dumb to understand that.
I am starting to believe that he's niggerpill trying to shit the thread, there's no way someone can be that stupid.
Well, either that or a redditor who for some reason found himself posting here.

>>270176
Whatever new shader is probably fine.

>>270152
I like unfiltered emulation when the game demands pixel-perfect gameplay or near enough that it makes a significant difference.
I never bothered with shader autism before but I might the next time I play a retro game. Still not worth spending money on special hardware though.

>>270176
>random names nobody ever heard before
take your meds schizo and go back to your sewer to smell huff mark's farts, your dramaniggery/identity fagging will be more than welcome there, not here

>>270168
Please take your medication.
>Here we were talking about old games looking much better on a CRT,  nobody was arguing that older games are "objectively unplayable" on newer monitors
So you agree with me that the hardware is useless?
>nobody here ever told you to buy a CRT
Oh boy, here we go. Nobody specifically said out loud that you should buy one, even though this thread is highly suggesting that it'd be good if you had one and your gaming experience is worse if you don't. Just spawn it out of thin air if you don't have one, right?
>>270169
What, is there a minimum success threshold for you? Crowd lined up for the premiere showing of Situation is Crazy before he's a real eceleb?
It's about the intent, you dumbass. Protip: every single man who uploads on that website would kill his firstborn to be the next Mr. Beast.
And I don't even know why we're arguing the semantics on this in the first place.
>>270179
Oh, so the link was video essay trash on top of it. What, am I gonna get replies showing me modern Spongebob reviews next?

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>>270185

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>>270175
So your argument is that since it's possible some incompetent/lazy devs didnt check their work on the hardware the consumer was going to be using, which was standard practice at the time. then that means the blocky graphics are equally likely what was intended to be seen?

>>270196
He also implies that these extremely lazy/incompetent devs not only had access to a display technology other than CRT, but even used that to develop their games.

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>>270196
>your argument is
I don't believe I've even made many arguments in this thread, I've mostly been refuting the crappy logic in the bad ones.

>which was standard practice at the time
That's a big assertion, but why should we accept it?

>>270213
Anon my fam, this is known as a "straw man".  Why do you feel the need to put words in another's mouth when you could be expending mental energy productively to construct an argument?

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>>270215
>we

Here's some quotes from game devs in the 16 bit era talking about it. 

https://crtdatabase.com/articles/art-design

"There was a difference in how colors blended on these systems, so we took that into account."

"[Eric] Iwasaki and the other artists used a Sega-developed program called Megawice for laying out art within 8x8 character tile maps. This was a common method on hardware of the period, as it efficiently rendered sprites and scrolling backgrounds. The artists would create their sprites in Deluxe Paint: Animation and then import them into Megawice. Then, they previewed the graphics on an actual television connected to Genesis hardware."
-Eric Iwasaki

"We had learned from Shiny Entertainment and other competitors how vertical line blending was more preferable on the TV than straight dithering. That is why everything looked weird on the PC. Those vertical lines blend automatically on the TV." -Jeff Jonas

"pixel art made for a clear RGB monitor and art made to look good on a TV set is completely different. So before development when we were deciding which look to go for I chose to prioritize home TV sets without hesitation and started drawing with that in mind."

Robert Hunter: It was tough, but thanks to how fuzzy NTSC displays were, you could create very cool dithering patterns that looked seamless to give you more colors than really existed.

They even talk in there about early on how they had to hand-dither each dot initially because there was no tool to create that effect. extra colors without having to use more vram was a huge deal. 

common knowledge, really. everyone that's not a zoomer knew this already. You're just ignorant. 
This started around the 16 bit era and quickly became common practice and was used even into the PS2 generation.

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>>270217

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>>270217
>some quotes
Only some.  The problem is you've chosen a very high bar to meet with evidence.  A handful of quotes isn't going to cut it for the sweeping hasty generalization you want us to accept, that this was somehow "industry standard".  For that you'll need a lot more evidence.  As in: something approaching a formalized survey from decades ago.  Can you produce this?  I highly doubt you can.

I'm sure you realize this though.  That's why you couldn't help but return to personal attacks at the end of your post.  Maybe it's not a smart idea to make hyperbolic assertions you can't back up, anon?  It just makes you look stupid and childish in the end.

>>270173
I regret buying a retrotink by the way. A crt tv is so so much better. The only problem is that crts where i live are very limited and hoarded so i didnt really have a choice. Composite looks like fucking shit on it. I know composite is terrible but on a crt its clear as day while on the retrotink text is basically unreadable.

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>>270224
>It just makes you look stupid and childish in the end.
>projecting this bad
Says the retard who's making a fool of himself for the entire thread while being proven wrong all the time.
No idea why anons here are still trying to argue with a dense faggot such as yourself,  when you are not just a mouth breathing retard, but you are even arguing in bad faith.

>>270226
I initially thought he was an autist but it's clear now that he's just pretending to be retarded.

>>270142
>actually seeing what the developers drew instead of a blurry mess
But the artists wanted to draw the "blurry mess" they just had to piss around with "crisp and clear" pixels first so that they got what hey wanted.

>their preference at the end of the day is entirely subjective.
It is BUT it's not subjective that certain things back then were designed for CRT displays.

>>270240
I like him he's baited everyone.

>>270240
>he's just pretending to be retarded
>pretending
No, he's actually retarded.

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lol @ thread

>>270245
>why even discuss anything at all
I like the techfag videos on the subject and threads like this because at one point I had entirely forgotten that old console games looked different on CRT vs emulation. The last time I played a pixel art game on a console, with a CRT, was over twenty years ago.

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>>270247
>at one point I had entirely forgotten that old console games looked different on CRT vs emulation. The last time I played a pixel art game on a console, with a CRT, was over twenty years ago.

Well, it's been a while since i played on a CRT myself, but i do remember one thing clearly:

It was 2008 i think, and i still had CRT's in my home, that year me and my brother got a PS3 (yeah, i know, i know) and we were waiting for some game that truly looked "next-gen" as i didn't find Uncharted (bundled with the console alongside LBP) to be all that impressive to be honest.
The first game that truly impressed me graphically was Resident Evil 5, and man, it looked graphically perfect, i really couldn't see any flaw in it (keep in mind i am merely talking about graphics here) and my mind was blown by how good it looked.
A few days after i started playing it, i upgraded my 32" CRT with a brand new, 40" 1080p HDTV.
When i resumed my playthrough on that one, something immediately looked wrong, like i could see that the picture quality was sharper, but i could also see shit like jagged outlines, washed out textures, and most importantly, the motion wasn't nearly as fluid as it was on the CRT, not to mention input lag was now a thing.
While HDTV definitely had a sharper picture and higher resolution, CRT had its strengths despite being a more antiquated technology.
This just to say that i noticed that as soon as i made the switch, it's not like 20 years later i got nostalgic and thought how cool CRT's were just because of some silly childhood memory attached to them.

However, claiming that something is objectively better just because it is newer is fucking retarded; it is like when kids claim that all music before they were born sucks and that current shit is better,  as if they couldn't appreciate something older simply because they did not experience firsthand the period when the best music came out.

One thing that for sure i won't miss about CRTs is weight.
Holy shit those things were heavy, the CRT i used to play vidya on, despite being "only" 32" was fucking MASSIVE.
But i wish i had kept a smaller one around.

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>>270247
How do you forget something like that? Video games peaked around the time we stopped using them. I usually have more than one CRT in my house, the TV monitor kind anyway, the CRT personal computer kind not so much. It being higher rez would make that a different sorta thing. I've wanted to make one of my system on a chip computers into a retro gaming console using a really shitty 5 inch CRT. They have them on ebay. One could make a stand alone computer.

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This sorta thing gets gen x and y penis hard. 

My current CRT is images related. Took forever to load lainchan back when I made the images. Never bothered to shove chip into frame though could have. It sucks how often you have to thinker to fix things like audio and screen ratios. Also, overclocking always seems necessary, not that I own any new chip.

>>270245
>2
Please don't tell me Riviera was actually a remake and that my life is a lie

>>270296
It has indeed been remade twice and the first time it was remade as you can see they didn't even try to make it look the same. Different poses and everything.  Wonderswan (color). GBA was not original version.

>>270245
>2nd pic
Soul vs Soulless

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>>270298
Hardcore CRT shading artists vs no shading was my joke. It looks worse in that image but the other screenshots look fine from 2002 version. It's too much shading. They tried to make it Super Mario RPG tier but failed. Then again it's for the shitty wonderswan so they needed it to look that way. Resolution issue. Same sorta ballpark as the CRT looking good issue even though it's LCD ironically it was low rez. Becaue the US has no soul we never got the Wonderswan because the US back then only copyright infringed anime and manga so nobody cared about all those rpg games on the thing. Too bad no Engrish patches will ever be a thing. I first took interest when I had a win98 copmuter, put a wonderswan emu on it and thought I'd learn japanese forcing me to play the Evangelion RPG and all. I did not learn it. Was too distracted and don't even have any Wonderswan roms or emus anymore. In some alternate timeline they made  third one and it'd be our favorite console. RIP alternate timeline, or long live alternative timeline, whatever. The gameplay looked good at least. The screenshots from the image searches often get it wrong, 2002 was not gba. The shots are mixed up but the wonderswan imagss have that Mario RPG tier shading.

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>>270281
>CRT personal computer kind not so much
You do know you can get 240i (with much higher frame rates) out of any monitor crt right? And even if it doesn't have composite, you can junk your way to the TV look.

>>270224
You moved the goalposts and still lost. What youre asking for is in the linked page, lmao. Official documentation telling devs to utilize that method.
The post even shows official software was developed to help them do this. And this was in the initial stages when this was adopted. It would be continued to be used for more than a decade.
You know there were not many devs back then, right? Because they needed to be licensed and use specific rare and expensive dev kits.

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>>270324
>You moved the goalposts and still lost.
rofl, still more straw men?

This level of wishful thinking is starting to look pathological, anon.  Your link doesn't in fact make the case you want it to make.  It provides a significant quantity of evidence for Mega Drive development, but only a pittance of testimonies for other platforms.  "Standard practice" is an enormous assertion that you simply haven't provided (and likely will never be able to provide) the evidence to support.

Why would you choose to misrepresent your source like this?  If you would like to shift your own goalposts and adjust the scope of the claim a bit to only Genesis games, you might have a more persuasive argument.

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By the way it's kind of hilarious that the Saturn shipped with a limitation like this, after hearing from all those Mega Drive devs who wish they had transparency support like the SNES.  What was SEGA thinking?

>>270329
Pretty neat idea to try and simulate transparency though

>>270329
The Saturn did support actual transparency, just not on all sprite layers.
This wasn't much a problem back then due to the vast majority of normalfag users playing vidya on CRTs with their consoles hooked via composite, which was the standard cable that came with Saturns/Playstations/N64s etc.

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>>270328
Nigger, your stupidity stopped being amusing a while ago.
It was standard practice, because at the time all consumers had a CRT at home, so developers developed games with that in mind, you retarded nigger.
<B-But muh evidence...
Get a brain transplant, you retard.

>>270343
Name calling is all you have.  You know the weakness of your position and you have to lean into insults to cope with your own intellectual insecurity.  Keep going anon, it won't make the claim any more credible.

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>>270224
>The problem is you've chosen a very high bar to meet with evidence.  A handful of quotes isn't going to cut it for the sweeping hasty generalization you want us to accept, that this was somehow "industry standard".  For that you'll need a lot more evidence. 
>>270328
>"Standard practice" is an enormous assertion that you simply haven't provided (and likely will never be able to provide) the evidence to support.
This faggot wants "evidence" that devs in the 80's, 90's and 2000's develop their games with CRTs in mind and not 4K OLED 80" screens instead lmao
Do you also need "evidence" if i tell you that in 1250 people used horses to travel instead of electric cars?

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>270347 Not even bothering giving a (You)
>Name calling is all you have.
>You know the weakness of your position and you have to lean into insults to cope with your own intellectual insecurity.
<---------------- You
Thanks for the good laugh, moron.

>two faggots who think they're ebin trolls by being pedantic jews
They are obsessed with pilpul because that's how they stalled the rabbi for time in between ass-rape sessions at schmul or whatever it's called.
Every second they pilpul is another second they have bought for their ravaged asses. That behavior is so deeply ingrained they simply can't stop.

>>270348
Sorry anon but systematic evidence is required to support a systematic assertion.  Anon, please.  You're a smart guy.  I know you have enough brain cells to rub together to realize that there is a distinction between claiming that some people did something versus claiming that a practice was so codified that effectively all people did it.  The former claim can be established by simply pointing to several examples.  The latter is a bigger assertion that requires more substantial support.  You don't need to take a class in set theory to get this.

Anons unable to concede this very basic discourse on logic must also be fans of the idea that if a board has a handful of faggots who post on it, it must therefore be entirely composed of faggots.  Or how about if I said that your favorite game series is a bad game series because it has some bad entries.  Hopefully grounding this fallacy in some other relevant examples can get you to realize why this is silly.

>>270302
I'm not about to play 'buy and return' with sites like amz to try to find a box that works. It'd show a black screen due to higher resolution going into lower monitor doing that and I don't think turning down your computer's rez to 240 is sane if even possible, the windows would glitch.

>>270350
Xitter and it's consequences have been a disaster for imageboards.

To the [ed8a42] autist:

Finally, we have a written, signed statement from EVERY SINGLE VIDEO GAME DEVELOPER who worked between the 1980s and the first half of the 2000s (yes, even those who are now dead) confirming that before HD LCD/LED TVs were even on the market, video games were developed to look good on CRTs.

It's pic related.

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>>270328
Not that anon, im the one who posted that link. Just anyone can look at it and see it has valuable information, including where you moved the goalposts and the link still met them. (at the bottom, after the quotes)

Embarrassing. 

Is the image you posted you after re-reading the information at the link? i hope so.

>>270354
>game devs in the 90s made games for HDTVs of the future.
oh, you're like an ultra retard. im sorry for making fun of you earlier. disregard my previous arguments. you're right. the pixelsheet is how devs intended it to be seen, even though it was impossible to be seen like that at the time.

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>>270364
>you moved the goalposts
Go ahead and actually quote some text where that was done.  Note: actual quote, not a madeup quotation that lives in your head.

>game devs in the 90s made games for HDTVs of the future.
Speaking of madeup dialogue that lives in your head, how is this even remotely related to the post you quoted?

Let's try an exercise here.  Can you identify the central point I've been making for days now?  I've stated it explicitly like three or four times now.

>>270363
I accept your concession.  Thank you for the battle anon.

>>270376
>caring about winning debates online with retards
That was your first mistake
t. person who wastes too much time arguing with retards online

>the jew duo pats themselves on the backs for saving their assholes from Rabbi schmekelstein for another few precious seconds

<CRTs were a blurry mess not like my ebin 4k curved monitor I got from my court settlement with Rabbi Schmeukelstein after he ravaged my ass which bleeds to this day
>actually pixel art was designed for the low resolution display and benefited from artifacting and other hardware effects
<I DEMAND SIGNED AFFADAVITS FROM EVERY VIDEO GAME DEVELOPER AND ARTIST FROM 1974 TO 2010
What can men do against such rampant faggotry

>bats are mammals, they are not birds
<DO YOU HAVE A NOTARIZED SIGNATURE FROM EVERY BAT ADMITTING THEY ARE NOT BIRDS? CHECKMATE, GOYIM

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>>270048
>>270114
>>270130
>>270142
>>270149
>>270153
>>270161
>>270170
>>270175
>>270185
>>270215
>That's a big assertion, but why should we accept it?
>we
>he's the only single retard in the whole thread arguing against it.
lol
>>270224
>>270328
>>270329
>>270347
>>270354
>>270354
> but systematic evidence is required to support a systematic assertion. 
>imagine even thinking you are smart for typing this shit lol
>>270376
>>270380
>unironically samefagging to agree to your own stupid posts.
>>270376
And with this, ed8a42 confirms himself official lolcow of the whole thread.
Congrats!

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>>270390
Yes, anon, "we".  As in: the participants and everyone else observing a debate from the sidelines including yourself (?).  Unfortunately these exchanges have been lost on you as you've only managed to fixate on messengers and personalities instead of logic and evidence.  Maybe anonymous discussion isn't for you, anon.

Good job yet demonstrating yet again why thread IDs were a mistake.

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>>270389
Just you wait for that moron to come back and type:
< "B-but you made the bold claim that devs worked on CRT monitors before HD lcds even existed, so it's up to you to prove that with tangible proof that EVERY single developer in existence at that time did that. Eh eh, looks like i won this argument!"
When you think everything is bad and life is unfair, remember that, even if you have all the problems in the world, at least you are not anon ed8a42...
...or Anthony Burch.

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Yet in all this faggotry, the faggot-in-chief never responded to >>270341.

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>270391
>all that butthurt rambling
>Good job yet demonstrating yet again why thread IDs were a mistake.
Good job demonstrating yet again why your mom should have been on birth control.

>>270363
Not him but (obviously) but: PC games notwithstanding. The shading black magic wasn't needed for pixel art all the time. Maybe with Doom's opengl shading I guess but the SNES was going to be trash with all that texture missing and rouding things out didn't matter for that comparison. It was console TV montitors mostly, unless most devs  that worked on PC games also worked on console games in which case a spillover would be expected in their art style.  And first half of 2000s? Metroid Prime as an example doesn ot need to be on CRT, it damages the art in that case. Lots of PC games and gen six games would be better on LCD at that point. Gen 5 cuttoff for console games so says I with the black magic pixel art. As it is I would play Metroid Prime on a rear projection CRT TV, a really big one you have to sit in front of in the specific proper place to see it properly, regardless.

and I concede that if it's pixel art and a sprite it should be CRT. You get that Golden Sun look otherwise that tries to look like Yoshi's Island and fails. You can see it sorta in the recent remake I posted up there, look at the eyes and shit. Awful remaster that I posted ironically. Some art should be more modest, leave something for the imagiation. Looks better 'far away'.

>>270392
Anon's mistake was replying to that faggot like he's a human being.
tranny faggot jews aren't human.

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>>270390
Anon is soygasming.

>Obviously the devs of the time wanted the game to look like this emulator but were limited by the CRTs of the time
>Obviously Michelangelo wanted the fresco to look like this digital art but was limited by the paint and plaster of the time.
This argument is ludicrous.

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I played on CRTs from 8-bit through 32-bit. I guess Quake II was the last game I finished, and I didn't have a 3D video card so I played it with software rendering at the lowest resolution (320x240), which was actually plenty fast on my Pentium 120.
Now I just have a cheapass 5:4 LCD.

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>>270403
>t. ed8a42

>>270046 (OP) 
I actually got a crt not too long ago but I've ended up watching more x-files on it than playing any games.

>>270411
Thanks for your continued meltdown, by the way. Explains the scalpernigger condition way better than I ever could.
For the rest of you: sure! Go ahead and fork it over for a magical retro box. Your money will go directly into his pockets. That's what you're funding.

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Arkanoid on a Commodore 1084 monitor. This was as close as it gets short of playing the arcade cabinet.

>>270399
Don't forget about the PS2 with its interlaced framebuffer, which Sony probably made to shit on ed8a42.
>Metroid Prime as an example doesn ot need to be on CRT, it damages the art in that case.
Most 6th gen games still benefited from the excellent motion clarity and contrast ratio modern displays still can't fully match, though it's also the same generation where apart from the PS2 developers largely moved away from color blending+dithering wizardry hence HD texture packs combined with increased emulator IR netting some really nice visuals, the 6th gen was also the first "standardized" generation with games targeting DirectX8+ and OpenGL on PC and mild variations/copypasta of those on consoles, except for the PS2 of course which still adhered to the high-functioning elder ways.

Would you an 4K120hz CRT even if it relies on an internal DAC for DP/HDMI support and weighs 2 tons with enough power draw to collapse a socialist grid?

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>>270414
>I am not butthurt, you are!
You are the biggest clown i ever witnessed on this site right after niggerpill.

>>270414
do you have a notarized signature that he's having a meltdown?
Thought not, checkmate.
I accept your apology.

>>270420
You are literally Chris-Chan if you don't consume product. He's got his soyjak folder prepared for you and everything.

I wonder if we could make lighter CRTs today. They are heavy because the glass tube has a vacuum inside, so by using a stronger glass you could use less material, and we should have some better glasses than back in the 2000s. And we could also shrink down the electronics quite a bit too.

>>270393
What's there to "respond to" exactly?  It wasn't part of the debate we're having and there's nothing particular to disagree with.

Are you that intellectually insecure that you think every exchange has to be part of an epic tit-for-tat mudsling?  Again, dumb faggots obsessed with reputation like you are making a good case for why thread IDs were a bad idea.

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At the lack of a real CRT. Is there anything comfier than the zsnes' NTSC filter?

>>270389
That's a really bad analogy anon.  Animal taxonomy can be assessed directly through physiological traits.  Bats have anucleated red blood cells and mammary glands, birds do not.  Any bat can have its genome sequenced to reveal that it has all the standard gene families that ally it with other mammals and not birds.  We can also observe the life history of a living bat from birth to death to see that it had mammalian parents and produces mammalian offspring.

Unlike the history of life on Earth, every video game is not the child of a parent video game.  Games do not inherit the traits of a parent game.  Old proprietary games are also fully formed and we cannot travel back in time and observe how they were developed.  If you had made the analogy of assessing the taxonomy of fossil organisms it would be closer but still has its limitations.

Developer intent while making a video game is an assessment that, faced with a paucity of remaining tangible physical evidence from the time of creation, relies heavily on evidence from witness testimony.    Since this can only be a subject of historical events, if you're going to make a precarious all-encompassing assertion about it, it requires more than a handful of testimonial anecdotes or the recommendations of a single manufacturer for a subset of consoles to establish.  It's more like, for example, asserting that every male in ancient Greece engaged in pederasty just because we have some pottery and graffiti poetry depicted pederasty.  The size of the evidence doesn't fit the size of the assertion.

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>>270442
Watch out, the thread's retard is about to pull the "i was merely pretending to be retarded" card.

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>>270442
All that pretentious, pseudo intellectual shit, but you still aren't able to give us a full statement from the bats themselves claiming that aren't in fact birds.
Seems like you lose again, retard.

>>270444
>the thread's retard is about to pull the "i was merely pretending to be retarded" card.
Of course he will, why do you think he's now typing this pseudo intellectual pretentious faggotry if not to later claim that he was merely "trolling" to save face?

>>270442
<Bats have anucleated red blood cells and mammary glands, birds do not
A bold claim. You need to address the
<paucity of remaining tangible physical evidence from the time of creation
and get me data on every single bird or bat to exist, that has existed, or will exist, with signatures and sworn statements, so I can determine whether bats are indeed not birds.
Since
<The size of the evidence doesn't fit the size of the assertion
You absolute faggot.
I accept your complete and utter defeat. Good day.

>>270390
I didn't even disagree with you, retard. I just told you that arguing with retards is a waste of time, and that I would know because I do it.
But thanks for proving my point I guess.

>>270457
Well if you are >>270380 then maybe it's your fault for replying to ed8a42 instead of any other Anon that was making fun of him, because by directly quoting him, your post looked like you were defending that moron.

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>>270456
>or will exist
So you've arrived at such an indefensible position now that you're actually leaning into even more extreme hyperbole.  Were we to extend your (already shitty) analogy now to the unjustified assertion about the history of video games development, we would now have to allow for the invention of new games decades ago to observe how they will be developed... in the past.  Do you feel silly yet?

>>270435
I have an idea for a multi-deflection Chromatron style tube that should be comparable in form factor to 2010s flatscreens, although it's definitely not going to match the absurdly thin ones you can find today.

>>270461
>>270435
They were working on making "flatscreen" CRTs in the early 2000s, but through a combination of legal jewery and plasmas just getting too popular they never hit commercial production.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface-conduction_electron-emitter_display
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field-emission_display

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>>270463
>They were working on making "flatscreen" CRTs in the early 2000s, but through a combination of legal jewery and plasmas just getting too popular they never hit commercial production.
This looks pretty cool, such a shame.
I think nowadays there would be a market for this.

>270460 
>Do you feel silly yet?
You should ask yourself the same question, since you are the thread's buffoon.

 I am going to warn you right now that the excuse "I was just pretending to be moron, and you all fell for it eheh" is not going to work, if you were thinking about using that one, faggot.

>>270440
Yes. I have been using
https://github.com/CyberLabSystems/CyberLab-Mega-Bezel-Death-To-Pixels-Shader-Preset-Pack
and 
https://github.com/RetroCrisis/Retro-Crisis-GDV-NTSC
because while I do have CRTs, they are dump rescues and (obviously) old, so they have been knocked around a bit and could use some tuning. Moreover, while it's nice to play on original hardware, it's also very nice to be able to continue gameplay across devices. I have both options, but I typically go with emulation on modern devices.

Something I touched on that I want to reiterate for the wee little faggots that didn't have these, any CRT you're looking at is old as fuck, has probably never had a tuneup, and probably has way too many hours on the lamp leading to smudging in motion and darker overall picture than there should be - if you've ever even seen a tube in person at all. It's something I think all the nostalgiabaiting CRThumpers need to keep in mind too. As much as I love CRT, it's never coming back, and all that does exist is degrading in quality. Yeah, I know that OLED is only starting to get to where CRTs were forever ago, but I'd put my money on those OLED looking better than almost any CRT you can actually get your hands on and experience today.

>>270476
> As much as I love CRT, it's never coming back, and all that does exist is degrading in quality. Yeah, I know that OLED is only starting to get to where CRTs were forever ago, but I'd put my money on those OLED looking better than almost any CRT you can actually get your hands on and experience today.
As much as i wish i still had a CRT around, i'd be fine if they would manage to closely emulate its feature with filters, high refresh rate, and so on.

>>270442
Y'know I wonder if perhaps the developers never "intended" their games to specifically look good on a CRT, but simply made their games look good on CRT because it was the only type of display they themselves could afford or use in a practical manner so game looking good on CRT=game looking good in general.
Color LCDs as we know them today weren't a thing in the consumer space until the late 1990s and those Plasma vector displays used in University mainframe terminals by shitposting students to program some of the earliest dungeon crawling vidya in history when their professors weren't looking were typically tied to said University mainframes.
It's a similar story with GBA games and their garishly boosted color palettes in order to make up for the lack of a backlight on the original GBA, a route developers pursued despite GBA emulation being a thing during the system's lifetime.

>>270481
Get a modern TV and use one of the shaders I recommended above.

I bought a HDMItoRCA adapter for 3 USD and use it as a secondary monitor on my PC, the resolution is weird; first i had to make the CRT image fit on the screen using the secret menu (which in some models may be hard to find how to open it) and then using the NVIDIA configuration adjusting the overscan, but this creates a custom resolution and the pc thinks it's a 16:9 screen, so image is distorted, this isn't a issue because for watching video in MPV, you can set up a key to disable aspect ratio, making it occupy the full screen, going back to the 4:3 aspect ratio, and i tried the ps1 emulator and it also has a no aspect ratio fullscreen option that helps, more emulators probably have this option too...
I heard that in AMD graphic cards, the overscan configuration is done better and don't create this weird custom resolution (my crt is 1138x682) but i don't own any AMD GPU so i couldn't see it myself.

>>270419
How many solar panels and lead acid batteries does it take to collapse the socialist grid? 
>asks AI to do the maths for me
220ish 100 watt solar panels (and their batteries and etc).... if they paid us what they should I would. Then again I like being mobile and are thinking of buying a 5 inch crt so no I would not do that.

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>>270553
Oh but you can.

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>>270114
>crisp clear pixels
>shitty filter
Genuinely 8/10 bait because I've seen hordes of people who actually believe this.

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Anyway, I wanted to ask if anyone had heard of the Checkmate series of displays. It's a retro-styled display with modular input and modular output that aims to let you plug in a lot of different devices and still get high quality interlaced video. I hadn't ever heard of it until I saw someone on the fediverse mention getting one and being very happy with it.

https://www.checkmate1500plus.com/

>>270587
i don't understand why would you want that, is not even a CRT, i can buy a 19" IPS for 13USD

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>>270485
>Y'know I wonder if perhaps the developers never "intended" their games to specifically look good on a CRT, but simply made their games look good on CRT because it was the only type of display they themselves could afford or use in a practical manner so game looking good on CRT=game looking good in general.
It definitely was "looking good on CRT = looking good period"
It's like when past games had their cutscenes rendered at such low resolution and when in present day when they remaster the games those cutscenes are still at low resolution and look like shit on modern HD screens.
Because at the time, once devs saw that the cutscene looked good on the hardware of the time they thought it looked good period, and certainly didn't think about rendering those cutscenes at higher resolution for the HD screens of the future.
One example of this are the pre-rendered backgrounds of games like Final Fantasy or Resident Evil, or the cutscenes of Ada's campaign in the PS2 version of RE4, the devs/companies didn't even bother saving the source material for those because they saw that stuff looked good on the hardware of the time and though it looked good period.

>>270585
>crisp pixels
Apparently, this is the latest hipster trend from retards who only played "retro inspired" pixel shit from indie devs and think that is how pixel games in the past were supposed to look like, meaning like a shitty mosaic.
The difference between the developers of past eras and the hipster zoomer developers of today is that the developers of the past tried to make their games look as good as possible despite the limitations of the hardware of the time, trying to exploit every gimmick of both the hardware and CRT TVs to achieve the best possible aesthetic result.
Zoomer hipster developers, on the other hand, make their games look deliberately more squarish, lackluster, and simplistic convinced that that was the way to develop games of the past (or use it as an excuse to mask their lack of talent).
This is not the first time I've heard nonsense like, “Look how crisp and blocky individual pixels look on my 70” 4K smartTV!” from hipster faggots.

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>>270592
I just wanted to add, that many devs, just like the players, most likely only noticed how bad certain things looked on HD screens, only when they made the switch from CRT, where those things looked just fine, to HD screens.

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>>270595

>>270595
Last time i set up my ps2, i tried to make a comparison with Tekken5 setting it up on a CRT and a slightly old LED TV (with SCART), but it was like something was wrong, somehow, the LCD looks even blurrier but clean at the same time, I don't know if this is due to the TV being bigger or something and that messes the aspect ratio or something, also I'd say the color in the LCD is probably better. But you notice that something is wrong, is like having diopters on the eye, i think is because the LCD has a pixel perfect screen, and the CRT actually blends the colors, so the best thing to explain it, is that image of the eye above this. Another thing, that i don't know to which point helps or not, is that CRTs have a slight curvature, but i don't know if that's good or bad, i personally like it.

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>>270585
>>270596
>>270595
You're only affirming your own insecurities about preference with these, the right side looks like shit on most of them.

>>270592
>the oldies were always trying their hardest, those whipper snappers are just lazy
The smug self delusion is getting off the charts in here.  Sure anon, everyone who has come to the realization that you need an army of artists to draw at the resolutions of modern screens is just a hipster Zoomer.

The realization that you can draw for lower resolutions and upscale and still make a great looking game is the healthiest thing that's happened to 2D gaming in the last decade.  Dumbfuck graphic whores with unrealistic expectations had killed 2D gaming before that.  It still is dead on the corporate/console side made sellout whores like SNK actually believe this crap, but now indie devs have picked up the torch where it was dropped.

>>270607
>he's still going

>>270609
>he still has no argument

>>270609
Amazing that even on an anonymous imageboard, someone can still become a lolcow.

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>>270607
>The ed8a42 retard is still screeching after being humiliated
Guys, i think we broke him.

>>270588
Just the ease of plugging in your actual hardware without needing a gorillion converters, I guess? Not really something I'd buy but I can't fault people for being lazy. I assume they're de-interlacing stuff in the end after all, and even if they have an algorithm for it that isn't entirely thrash I still doubt it's actually nice.

>>270607
https://apps.apple.com/us/app/tiktok/id835599320

Just leave man

>>270559
Fucken past-niggers stole my idea!

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>>270607
< You're only affirming your own insecurities about preference with these, the right side looks like shit on most of them.

>>270587
>So why not just make a CRT?
<We get asked this a lot, and as owners of many beloved old CRT's ourselves we Totally Get It. Short answer: we'd have loved to, but the stark reality is you just can’t get CRT tubes anymore, and good job too as apart from anything else they are environmentally catastrophic.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cathode-ray_tube
<Leaded CRT glass was sold to be remelted into other CRTs, or even broken down and used in road construction or used in tiles,concrete, concrete and cement bricks, fiberglass insulation or used as flux in metals smelting.
Anyone who ever complains about "Muh environment" is someone not worth supporting as they display that they know jack fucking shit about it each and ever time they open their mouths.

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>>270607
>Ellis looks worse than the left version
You need to be gassed

This is official art btw

>>270607
Well, you got all the retrannies in the thread to shut up, and they're all obsessed with you. So good job I guess.
Maybe we can have actual discussions in this thread now instead of just shitflinging.

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>>270633
>nationality

>>270596
Metal Gear Solid 1 was peak CRT graphics.

>>270632
What they're saying is you legally cannot due to environmental regulations you spastic. 

>>270640
I disagree, I think peak CRT would have been the spritework in the preceding generation. Once you start to get into 3D games, I think the benefits start to wane, with the exception of horror media, which I think really shines on a CRT. The soft glow of the tubes, their deep blacks, high contrast...it's peak horror imo. I think REmake on the GameCube was an excellent representation, especially since an upscaled/remastered version can be bought and played today on modern hardware for comparison.

>>270633
>sex woman
The Japanese games industry is superior.

>>270642
There is plenty of awesome 2D to enjoy in that game, just look at the main menu.

>>270642
>What they're saying is you legally cannot due to environmental regulations you spastic. 
No, they're not. First of all, if it was because of environmental laws, they would actually say that it's because of environmental laws. Second, as detailed, the "only" way that those "environmentally catastrophic" components like lead glass cathode ray tubes can be recycled is by using them to make other cathode ray tubes. IOW, the "Safest" action for the environment would actually be to reuse those very same components that would harm said environment. Third, even if they cannot produce "authentic" cathode ray tubes because of environmental regulations preventing the use of lead glass (Which are 100% safe by the way because of how they're created), they could still use OTHER methods of making cathode ray tubes. Such as using barium-strontium glass.

So, no, his excuse is shit every way you look at it.

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>>270642
There is no greater horror media than what your imagination constructs. You don't need special display for that, but the CRT glow is a nice touch, when playing in the dark. And of course the black screen background is actually black, provided you don't have the intensity cranked up (it should be: intensity=low, contrast=high).
Another nice feature with old text adventures (on their original hardware) was the slowness of the parser. Once you type your command and hit enter, there is a pause, because the 4 MHz Z80 (or whatever other 8-bit CPU) is crunching the data needs time to interpret your request, process it, update its internal data structures, and then finally spit the output on the screen. It might take 1 or several seconds... And if you're in a sticky situation or fighting a monster, you will be holding your breath during that time. :->
Pic is Osborne 1 >>270559 5-inch CRT.

>>270653
is that zork

>>270653
>There is no greater horror media than what your imagination constructs
This is probably another contributing factor to why I think CRTs are great for horror - the lower resolution leaves more to the imagination. Walking through the foggy streets of Silent Hill with the deep blacks and soft glow of a CRT putting out 240 lines of resolution will always be something special, and I don't see it being possible to get that same blurry, dreamlike haze anywhere else.
I never played those classic text adventures back then, my family didn't have a computer at home until later (that same black Dell that everyone seemed to have) but I can imagine that was a great experience.

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>>270653
You can go even slower with a teletype.

>>270587
>"not retro for its own sake but reproducing the DNA of historic devices."
What in the frilly fuck does that even mean!?
>that cringey obese rabbit video
>all that blue border bullshit around Sonic 
>consol tier ui popping up all over monitor rather than subtle tactile adjustments
>that gay voice
<we "can't" make real old style shit!
It ain't because of the environment. If working CRTs are still around and cheap then the materials are still there, obviously. What even am I watching/skimming?  Ban lithium and old cars then, faggots. All this 'don't use old shit' because of electricity and etc, it's just because of shills for new tech. CRT material makers unavailable because they retired, now new kikes, their kids, sell LCDs againast your will and if they go bankrupt then their retired parents will bail  them out anyway by forcing people to buy this fake shit. Grandpa-kike needs to get back to work. I wanna feel my retina vibrate damn it! Not to the point of Virtual Boy vibrating mirror graphics though....Goldilocks zone visually, this ain't it. 
>>270708
Mildly insane.

>>270715
Is this the deepseek revolution?

>>270716
>insults me
>his reply count is (1)

>jewish faggot and his anus porter are still posting itt
Addicted to humiliation I see.

>>270716
Did you understand anything of what it said?

>>270046 (OP) 
i like scanlines too but left has a more cool and unique aesthetic and the right is just a waterfall
its better for sprites with more detail

>>270046 (OP) 
No because they're too expensive to get anything good, or at least for what i require. What i really want is a CRT for it's motion clarity rather than it's defects. And primarily a PC CRT monitor. To make up for what OLED cannot provide for modern gaming. That's a little off topic from 4th gen, but i do believe in the benefits of CRTs for gaming in a different area. We took a major step backwards with LCDs and I'm still wondering when we will finally catch up to what a CRT feels like to use at 60hz. My honest to god opinion is that CRT at least 60hz to 85hz it feels like it's running beyond 480hz, maybe even 1000hz. That's how responsive and smooth and quick it looks, or more importantly how clear it looks when things start moving. Nothing even comes close. All we need is the blur busters UFO to tell the story here.

>>270464
>>270463
>we could have kept using crt
Gods I hate this timeline.

Phasing out CRTs was the ultimate crime against gaming, period. They did not have anything in place that was suitable whilst the transition was occurring at the time and still don't have anything that is an adequate replacement. Black Frame Insertion and even some of the better implementations of OLED's motion features still aren't up to snuff. I guess because gamers were low priority of any display technology. But the thing is that today that has massively changed and consumer TV brands are targeting that audience now. Yet there's no one that has stepped up with a plan to address the solution of how we got short changed. Who let this happen? there should have been something in place from preventing this situation to ever occur. Because as i said. I think 75hz or something is enough to be 1000hz in perceived clarity.

>>274083
Is this a pasta?

>>274093
No. I'm just genuinely confused about why modern high resolution/high refresh rate monitors don't look on the same level of a CRT with a lower refresh rate, or even a higher one. LCD backlight strobbing technologies and OLED cannot compete. The prior known as ULMB. Or the motion blur reducing functions found on OLED is like motionpro or something and it's similar to BFI. Or the highest refresh rate/lowest input lag zowie TN panels that have reached the 500hz range already and have their own version of traditional ULMB called DyAc 2. But still cannot go blow for blow with a CRT. It's like alien technology that we can't figure out how to bring back, it was conceived on a different planet from ours. I assume most likely because it has to be smaller form factor to make it viable. But the actual manufacturing process may be very difficult now. I assume there's also something the tree huggers would complain about if they were resurrected too. I have a different view of the technology because i think it's still viable today as something that belongs in modern screens. Maybe it will be attained in the future through use of Nvidia's DLSS technology. Such techniques like motion interpolation and re-projection to one day hopefully match a CRT. I don't know if it will match but I'd like to hope so.

>>270046 (OP) 
Unfortunately, not all of us have CRTs anymore. The crt-royale and crt-hylian shader from libretro is pretty decent for mimicking the CRT effect though, but you may have to fuck with crt-royale (the higher quality option)'s settings and whatnot to get it looking like you want.

Anyway, if you want to stick a post-processing shader on your game to get retro effects, go install reshade: https://reshade.me/

>>270046 (OP) 
Unfortunately, not all of us have CRTs anymore. The crt-royale and crt-hylian shader from libretro is pretty decent for mimicking the CRT effect though, but you may have to fuck with crt-royale (the higher quality option)'s settings and whatnot to get it looking like you want.

Anyway, if you want to stick a post-processing shader on your game to get retro effects, go install reshade: https://reshade.me/

Or install retroarch or BSNES if you want filters on emulators.
https://www.retroarch.com/
https://bsnes.org/

>>274083
>>274131
>They did not have anything in place that was suitable whilst the transition was occurring at the time
Plasma TVs were a thing and SED was in development, but Plasma was taken off the market after the financial crisis and SED never even reached the market due to ((( reasons ))) even though it would've been the ideal CRT successor, had it entered the mass market 144hz monitors would've come out half a decade earlier and HDR would've never had local dimming faggotry.

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did this board always have crt threads like these? Or is it just because 4chan /vr/ invaded here?

>>274747
>did this board always have crt threads like these?
No.
>Or is it just because 4chan /vr/ invaded here?
No, the thread predates the happening.

>>274314
>SED never even reached the market due to (((  reasons  ))) even though it would've been the ideal CRT successor
What were those reasons, anon? I'd really like to know why we can't fucking have flatscreen CRT.

>>274913
>reasons
Patentnigger disputes followed by the financial crisis.
SED is basically a CRT, except instead of a triplet of large electron guns enclosed in a big fat evacuated glass tube shooting electrons at a phosphor mask to make it glow in 3 base colors, every individual pixel would have its own tiny set of electron guns shooting straight ahead at a phosphor mask so close to the gun/emitter itself it wouldn't need to be in a vacuum.
Prototype TVs from 2005(!) had 1ms pixel response time with engineers saying they could get it down to 0.5ns, but of course such anti-semitism wasn't allowed to reach the market because all flat panel displays have to be based off the LCD production process or else :^)

>>274913
SED/FED died because building, installing and driving millions of CRTs smaller than a grain of rice was way more expensive and difficult than just scaling up LCD tech, even after taking into account how much of an ordinary CRT can be left out when it's one subpixel. Plasma died because consumers cared more about burn-in, cost and weight than they cared about deep blacks or motion quality. (Those first two are also why OLED hasn't taken over the world yet.) Neither technology is the magic super CRT idiots on 4cuck and youtube have let you to believe because they still have native resolutions, meaning what you gain in motion quality you immediately lose from the garbage scaler's delay.

>>270097
It's not worth your time convincing anyone that's unable to realize the simple truth themselves: that old video games were made on old displays, and made to look good on old displays

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>>270046 (OP) 
I don't own a CRT nowadays, so I just use shaders.

>>270157
I chose to believe everyone agrees with this and are just arguing because they're bored.

>>274083
What about plasma?
I always thought plasma displays looked fine...

Just a reminder that the authfags of this board won't ban the likes of ed8a42 despite how much cuckchan slang he uses, but will ban you for months if you make fun of said 4um babble.
>>270225
>The only problem is that crts where i live are very limited and hoarded so i didnt really have a choice.
No shame there. Trust me, if I could find a Sony BVM where I lived and everything I needed to make it take SCART cables, I would. But I can't, so even if a RetroTINK isn't going to be a proper CRT, it's really the best I can do.
>>274228
>>274230
>IP hopping to post almost the exact same thing again

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>>278485
Trust me, you don't need a BVM. You don't need RGB unless you're a eurofag and RGB-capable TVs were actually common in your country. All you need is a curb TV from the mid 90s to early 2000s with an acceptable number of inputs and an appropriate size for your battlestation, plus a few hours in the service menu with a test pattern generator. Even S-Video is a nice-to-have, really, as long as the tube wasn't ass to begin with and hasn't blown through its hours limit composite is perfectly fine all the way through 6th gen, and if the tube is shit or roached RGB won't save you.
t. wrote the CRT guide for sleepystation

>they're STILL butthurt

Just use a CRT filter.